Misc feedback requests

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Torven, Aug 27, 2015.

  1. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I'm going to use this thread to ask questions from AK players about content.

    The first of which are:

    1) Did Venril Sathir have an AoE mez on Al'Kabor? It's not in the logs I've searched.

    2) What was Master Yael's max hit? Posts on this guy seem to be all wrong. I've seen 300 damage mentioned, and even 600. One guy said 161, which I think is the most likely correct answer. Also people claim his DT is 30 seconds, but all evidence points to 45 seconds. I have no logs of this one.
     
  2. Lenas

    Lenas I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I don't remember any version of Venril Sathir ever having a mez of any kind.
     
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  3. PompeiiEQ

    PompeiiEQ Member

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    Now, Yael isn't a complete wimp. He has 32k hp, hits for 167's, and nukes so easy there, but he also DT's every 30 seconds.

    Excerpt from the strength of the elements quest page on allahkazam. The times I fought him on AK he never hit for much past the 160's. But that was a level 65 SK with luclin/PoP gear.
     
  4. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    Neither do I, but the spell ID for the mez spell is right around the Kunark era, and P99 had posters claiming that it existed. When I parsed his resists on Live, he didn't do it; my AK logs have zero mention of it; and my 2001 logs show no mention of it. So unless somebody gives me evidence, it's not going in.

    As for Yael, I saw a progression server video of his DTs 45 second apart. Every other DTing mob I've seen has it 45 seconds apart, but some people make the erroneous claim that mobs I have confirmed are 45 seconds, are 30. So when I see claims of Yael's DTs at 30, I think they are probably wrong, but I don't have the logs.
     
  5. Seknah

    Seknah Member

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    He mezzed in Kunark beta, but didn't make it in as far as I know. I have never seen it at all in all my times raiding him. I do recall an AE Lifetap though but it was changed to single target I believe at some point I do not recall.

    Yael I remember being 36 seconds DT, but I could have miscounted in either direction. I do recall getting hit no higher than 167 with most hits being between 82 and 161. I think he had an AE Lifetap too?

    If I had my old hard drive I had logs galore of all the fights up through Gates of Discord. I know I have it somewhere just not sure where, nor do I know if it can still be accessed.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  6. Ravenwing

    Ravenwing I Feel Loved

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    Sathir's Mesmerization has a mana cost and Venril Sathir is a warrior, which is the reason he didn't cast it on Al'Kabor. I imagine this was originally an error, but if so it persisted for years and years after Kunark's release. (Someone once told me that VS was eventually made into an SK on live, and that he did start using the AE mez, but I haven't seen this for myself.)

    I agree that Yael's melee DPS was unremarkable. I don't recall his max hit myself, but someone on the Tem forums said 161 back in 2004.
     
  7. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    Thanks for the previous responses. I have a couple more requests:

    1) Please list the NPCs you *ARE CERTAIN* had significant combat regen (other than VP dragons, which was mentioned) and an estimate of how much regen. Virtually every NPC on live has negligible combat regen, and I'm trying to find out if it was altered in any way over the years.

    2) Did Nagafen, Vox, Sontalak, or Klandicar's fear have a chance to land even with MR well over 200? The spell Dragon Roar (id 981) has a maximum effective resist value of 150 on live currently, meaning any resists above 150 (after factoring in level) do nothing. Actually the Nag/Vox breath AoEs do as well. However it was added to the spell data in 2006, days before the first progression servers launched. It's possible they hardcoded it in before that and just made a field for it in 2006; I read some claims that Terror was the hardest golem.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2015
  8. Luddwig

    Luddwig Member

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  9. Elroz

    Elroz People Like Me Staff Member

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    I think on sont/kland those fears were tough to resist but only because they were level 70 and everyone was level 60. 10 level gap made a huge difference. We had bards doing resist song on ntov geared tanks on sont/kland and I remember fears still hitting, that being said they could have had their resist buffs dispelled too.
     
  10. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    10 level gap should add a -50 resist deficit. 5 level gap should be a -12 deficit. So a level 60 should be immune with 250 MR against a level 70 NPC.
     
  11. Lenas

    Lenas I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I soloed both Sontalak and Klandicar at level 70 as a Ranger which would have been nearly impossible if I was getting feared. At some point it became a non-concern. I never used fearless or resist disciplines because I was either using trueshot or saving weapon shield.
     
  12. Ravenwing

    Ravenwing I Feel Loved

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    Venril Sathir had considerable combat regen. Even without any lifetapping whatsoever, his health would visibly rise at some points during combat. As a wild guess, 800/tick?
     
  13. Ravenwing

    Ravenwing I Feel Loved

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    I've been trying to remember whether Dragon Roar could be consistently resisted. My gut says no - I think I've been feared by Talendor and Ragefire with very high MR - but I can't be certain this didn't happen early on, when Raven's MR was lower.

    This makes me think that there must have been a built-in resist cap on such effects, however. Rydda'Dar (level 75) had a -200 MR fear that landed more often than not on level 65 players with MR at 500.
     
  14. Speedz

    Speedz Administrator Staff Member

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    If you can find this hard drive, PM me. I can probably get you in touch with something that can recover logs and anything else lost on the drive. Provided it is not physically damaged.
     
  15. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I observed a combat regen rate of 100/tick for Venril on Live, which is actually abnormally high for an NPC of that era. I parsed his hitpoints at 18k. This would increase HP 1% every 2 ticks if no damage were being done. Sontalak was 50/tick, Klandicar was 100/tick. Most classic and Kunark stuff was actually 1 or 0. Lots of Luclin stuff was either 0 or 1 as well. ToV stuff was mostly 30/tick. PoP stuff is usually 100/tick. Many bosses would very slowly lose hp while I was chain casting level 1 DDs for resist logs.

    Outdoor Kunark dragons use a different fear, which has a -150 adjust.

    I actually parsed PvP resists on Al'Kabor before it shut down, and determined that resists over 200 would bug out and INCREASE the chances of spells landing from the 200 peak. (data is here http://www.peqtgc.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=14337 ) I later discovered that PvP and PvE resist calculations use different formulae however, at least on Live. It's possible AK's PvE resists were also bugged, although the numbers don't quite work out. I can say that without changes to our resist algorithm, a -200 fear will not land on a player with 500 MR.
     
  16. Darchon

    Darchon I Feel Loved

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    I farmed Venril Sathir on my Enchanter/Druid for awhile on Al'Kabor. I can pull my logs for total damage/duration and figure out regen per tick based on this if we are assuming 18k base HP.

    I also don't recall any mez being used but it seems that issue has already been resolved.

    Another mob with high combat regen was Cazel from Oasis/Enchanter Epic. Lots of quotes in the 200-300/hp a tick in combat on him.

    @Torven I am fairly sure the -150 MR fear was used by Velious Dragons (Wuoshi, Zlandicar, Klandicar, Sontalak), not by the Kunark Dragons (Gore, Tal, Sev, Fay). They used the same one as Nagafen/Vox.

    They were both called Dragon Roar at one point and eventually one was renamed to be Dragon Fear. It should be easy to verify on live if you can catch one up.
     
  17. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    Nope. Other way around.

    [Tue Sep 23 18:11:57 2014] Zlandicar begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Roar>
    [Sat Sep 20 08:01:00 2014] Klandicar begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Roar>
    [Tue Sep 16 03:36:55 2014] Sontalak begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Roar>

    [Sun Jul 19 22:11:05 2015] Gorenaire begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Fear>
    [Mon Mar 23 02:26:19 2015] Talendor begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Fear>
    [Wed Mar 25 02:42:33 2015] Severilous begins to cast a spell. <Dragon Fear>

    Parsing resists on the Velious dragons was a PITA because they are belly casters and the fear on Live has a chance to always hit.

    I did measure Cazel's regen rate awhile ago, but I didn't put it in my spreadsheet, so I can't remember what it was. I don't think it was 300 though. It seems the high regen mobs are still higher than typical regen on Live, but everybody gives higher estimates from what I measure.
     
  18. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    Actually I had forgotten that Zlandicar's AoE was the same as Nag and Vox's. I 5 boxed Zland just before the shutdown, and recorded it. None of my characters got feared, and they had shit for gear, so that pretty much solves the Dragon Roar question.

    Strange they gave the Velious dragons the weak fear.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2015
  19. Ravenwing

    Ravenwing I Feel Loved

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    I would be interested in the answer to this if you feel up to running it down. My recollection is that on Al'Kabor, VS's health would jump upward by multiple percentage points at a time, although I am not sure if this happened every tick. He also behaved oddly in combat - sometimes he'd stop swinging for a couple of seconds for no discernible reason - which makes me wonder if I was seeing sporadically bugged out-of-combat regen.

    Ah, good call. I also boxed Zlandicar without ever seeing fear land, to the point that I'd forgotten he actually used fear at all.

    Okay, having now read through your report on resists, I see that Crystal Roar is missing the Unknown 191 value you're talking about with regard to Dragon Roar in any case.

    I don't think PvE resists were bugged in the strange and counterintuitive way that PvP resists were; more was definitely better. Auliffe Chaoswind, for example, had a -250 MR spinstun, which your data suggests should be 100% resisted with MR at 451 or above, and this appeared to be true. (Or close to true; he landed it on my bard alt once in a blue moon, but I can't be certain his resists weren't below 451 even with PoV at the time.)

    But I do think your formula, and the PoTime logs you posted from Live back in 2004, indicate far more success in resisting high-end AE effects than I experienced raiding in PoP zones on Al'Kabor. I've mentioned Rydda'Dar, and I'm also pretty sure that the PoTime phase 4 mana drains weren't bouncing anywhere close to 85% of the time against toons with capped resists.

    Of course, I have no data, and I could certainly be wrong. Pity I never had the foresight to log anything!
     
  20. Darchon

    Darchon I Feel Loved

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    Interesting...

    It's possible they accounted for the level difference between the mobs.

    Kunark Dragons are all level 60, and Velious Dragons are 66-70. Maybe they put the fear without a check on the higher level dragons to yield the same number of overall resists?

    But it does seem counter intuitive. I knew they used different ones I just had assumed the higher level/later expansion ones used the harder to resist version because the game progressively got harder to account for better gear, etc.

    It's funny, Dragon Roar is a big issue on P99 right now, I wouldn't be surprised if they are operating under my assumption and they have the Velious Dragons using the incorrect Roar.
     
  21. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    They did change some of the AoEs to be easier to resist mid-PoP. Check Lucy's spell history.

    The current resist system was implemented in Luclin, and under this system a 10 level gap grants a level -50 modifier, which is a lot smaller than the -150 resist adjust on Kunark dragon fears. I can't say what the resist system was like prior to the Luclin patch, but the patch note said this:

    and

    Sounds like they had a resist softcap before they switched to the current linear scale.
     
  22. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    Can anybody tell me AK's spell drop rates on sebilite protector and Tolapumj? Or if you shy people with unsubmitted logs can grep them, that would be swell. Actually drop rate estimates on any Kunark 60 spell droppers like emperor chottal would be helpful. I don't want to blindly give them 1 guaranteed drop like every other emu when I know that's not how it was. Most of the 60 spell droppers have multiple spell drop tables, so examples are needed to know what to set each table to.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2015
  23. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    What was Venril Sathir's respawn time on AK?

    I assume the outdoor dragons were 7 days?
     
  24. necra

    necra People Like Me

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    I think the three kunark Dragons were 7 days +/- 12 hours or something like that
     
  25. PompeiiEQ

    PompeiiEQ Member

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    Kunark:

    Trakanon, level 65, instant, 3 day respawn, Old Sebilis
    Venril Sathir, level 58, 10 hr spawn, 3 day respawn, Karnor's Castle
    Talendor, level 60, <24 hr spawn, 3 day respawn, Skyfire
    Faydedar, level 55, <24 hr spawn, 7 day respawn, Timorous Deep (trigger respawn @ Hidden Oasis 12 hrs)
    Severilous, level 60, <24 hr spawn, 3 day respawn, Emerald Jungle
    Gorenaire, level 60, 3 day spawn, 3 day respawn, Dreadlands
    Chardok Royalty, levels 60-65, instant, 2 hrs, Chardok
    Veeshan's Peak Dragons, levels 65, instant, 7 day respawn, Veeshan's Peak
     
  26. robregen

    robregen Administrator Staff Member

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    first column is at server reset then respawn afterward.
     
  27. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    If you're quoting old web pages, link the page please. These pages are often inaccurate. (VS isn't level 58 for example) Respawn times change over time as well. I only ask something here if google's results give me questionable sources. Respawn times in particular are often hard to be certain of.

    I'd much rather have somebody who killed VS on AK grep their logs.
     
  28. Darchon

    Darchon I Feel Loved

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    Venril Sathir was 3 day and Kunark Dragons I think were 7 day.

    I'll check logs when I get home to see if I can find evidence from AK to back this up.

    I'm not sure if I ever did end up killing Trakanon on AK. I definitely killed a few Juggs during my attempts and I had a pretty substantial spell bank (had 6 characters full, 3 were 50-60 and 3 were 61-65s). I'm sure I can pick some logs from those kills.

    I definitely don't have any Chottal/Crypt spell drop rates though. Vintage I imagine would be more the people that would have those.
     
  29. Torven

    Torven I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I spent a couple of days crunching magelo numbers in a spreadsheet and I'm pretty sure I figured out how the spell drops were done
     
  30. Elroz

    Elroz People Like Me Staff Member

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    My recollection from live server was 3 day spawns for venril / open world kunark dragons / trakanon. 7 day VP dragons / velious bosses minus lord dojo which was 3 day. I know that's not AK and not concrete evidence, but it's all I got! I think originally the kunark open world dragons were 7 days lowered down to 3 days later, I don't know when that happened, it may have been in like 2000 or 2001. Also not sure if AK had the idol of rallos zek, but I think when they added him, they lowered statue of RZ's respawn timer to 3 days.