Silly questions

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Oiwon, Oct 18, 2015.

  1. Oiwon

    Oiwon People Like Me

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    My memory is a little fuzzy. Wasn't it possible on AK to potentially gain Experience from killing a Green con?
     
  2. Sturmm

    Sturmm Well-Known Member

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    Never, that I remember. You COULD get experience on alts if the mob was green to your toon but not to the alts, and as long as they were within the appropriate group range with you. But that's it, I never saw or heard of anyone gaining experience themselves on a green toon.
     
  3. Sturmm

    Sturmm Well-Known Member

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    And this has been fixed per the devs, here on TAKP :)
     
  4. Oiwon

    Oiwon People Like Me

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    Hmmm okay :)
     
  5. Seknah

    Seknah Member

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    XP from green cons went away when "Light Blue" was added to the game. The XP from green mobs were moved to the new color category. This was implemented some time around Velious when they added the Ally faction level to fix a bug with faction exploitation for the three Velious cities
     
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  6. furst

    furst Member

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    A lvl 40 would get exp off a green to the level 60(as long as it wasnt green to the 40) and get all the exp. This was a way of PLing on AK, but the devs didnt want to reproduce that. Honestly I do not think I would want it added back in.
     
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  7. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    I don't see a problem with it. Though it is a spread between levels, a side benefit is that it promotes grouping.
     
  8. furst

    furst Member

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    It's very exploitable in the leveling department
     
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  9. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    So you consider PLing to be an exploit? How about if a druid, shaman, cleric PLs someone, that an exploit too?
     
  10. Khorpus

    Khorpus Well-Known Member

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    Don't twist words... "PLing is an exploit" is not at all what anyone is saying. I think all that is being said here is that if a group of mobs are green to someone that can just lay waste to an entire zone of them where it doesn't benefit them (xp wise), but the lowbie in group sucks it all up is pretty full of wash. If 5 level 60's can take a level 1 to 50 in a retardedly small amount of time by just leaving them in group while they farm something high level is lame sauce. I believe they are attempting to stick to trying to have a more semi-realistic world in this case.

    PLing works quite differently, a druid or cleric/mage (or whatever, really) might be able to DS someone out of group and keep them healed for a minute for a few levels but it goes away pretty quick once mobs are a little harder. If you tried it with the same scenario as above, nothing would die because the ds wouldn't be near enough damage to do anything, aside from killing the lowbie from lack of hp/ac and everything else.

    It makes perfect sense that once simple uber buffs aren't enough that you should have to group with people within the group xp level requirements. It might cause a little gleam in the eye for a minute and it should be rewarding to be able to help lower levels with your high level characters to an extent, but this game is supposed to be difficult and leveling isn't supposed to be a quick PL-fest else all of the fun would be sucked out of it and being max level wouldn't mean anything.

    Green mobs are exactly that, green. Once a mob is green to someone in group then xp should be negated as it is right now, for good reason. I don't understand why a few of you insist on thinking that taking advantage of exploits or super cheesy options or uber GM hand-outs is fun, interesting, or rewarding enough to actually piss and moan or try to defend them on the forums.

    -edit- "retardedly" is a new word I made up, i think.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
  11. Khorpus

    Khorpus Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
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  12. Khorpus

    Khorpus Well-Known Member

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    How does this promote grouping? If you were level 55 and a level 35 joins your group, you know that they won't be doing any damage, no spells will land, and that they can't take any hits. They may as well afk. This only promotes leveling alts at record speeds.
     
  13. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    You need to settle down a bit, Khorpus, and your cute little Jackie Chan picture comes across as hostility. If you want to be hostile, I can play that game no problem.

    I didn't twist anyone's words around. If you want to push this issue, go right ahead. Show me how I twisted his words around, you know how to quote me right?

    He's calling it an exploit, not me. I asked if he felt PLing through other means was an exploit, it was a question. In what universe is asking a question a means of twisting words?

    You are generalizing the hell out of this, and you should know as well as anyone that this game is very complex, judging by what I've read from you. You can't put a bandaid fix on something without effecting everyone else.

    Who's to say that a level 40 cleric with complete heal wouldn't we helpful to a group of level 60's in another zone? This game mechanic that you are bashing has been in place, as far as I know, up until 2009 and beyond. How often does it really happen anyway that a 40 is going to group with a bunch of 60's and get some levels? It's happened to me on occasion and it's not that big of a deal. Usually in cases where a higher level is farming for an item, but you're acting like the lower level is doing nothing. That may be true, but not in every case. It's not a perfect world, you can't idiot proof everything.

    I'll have words with anyone that wants to come here and rewrite the rules of the game because it doesn't suit them. The game staff has pledged that this game will be based on the Al'Kabor server. Changing the 1 and 1/2 times rule is a big change. If you don't like it, why don't you offer an alternative then?

    I have a simple solution myself, instead of everyone trying to reinvent the wheel, how about we all just live with the current ruleset, one that we all seem to be able to live with? One that's been in place long after the expansions have marched on past any era anyone would consider classic. After all we are playing the game in it's current state, it appears everyone so far can live with the way things are.. If we start changing the rules it's going to do nothing but discourage players. I have a problem with people on a whim complaining about a game policy but then not offering or considering alternatives in the future as a substitute.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
  14. Elroz

    Elroz I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I think on live servers the low level in the group still had the exp divided up based on how many people were in the group. What furst was calling exploitable is that on AK the low level would receive 100% of the experience as if they solo'd the mob, rather than it being divided up based on number of players in group. It was actually like that on TAKP for a very short time but was changed because people abused it to hit 50 on multiple characters in a very short time, when most the server was still leveling normally.

    edit : I just realized the topic of this thread was completely different. I think on live they had dark green and light green cons, which changed to light blue and regular green cons. The dark greens used to give exp though, I just don't remember what era that was. Anyways It sounds like it was light blue and regular green cons during AK's timeline at least.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
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  15. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    If someone is nice enough to take time and PL someone that is their business. Regardless it takes actual man hours to level the character whether it's done individually or through PLing. There are times where guilds need a certain class to fill a gap in their raid force. You can't police when this sort of thing is an exploit and when it isn't, and frankly, it's no one else's business how fast someone else levels.
     
  16. Elroz

    Elroz I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I agree for the most part. I just usually side with how things played out on live servers. If something was changed around this era of the game, then it was probably seen as an exploit/bug to verant/sony. Some are definitely more obvious than others, like being able to paci a mob twice and then it would be permanently pacified until it's killed... or shadowknights getting a full mana bar from each mental corruption proc, those are pretty major bugs and exploitable in my opinion, but they were just a normal game mechanic on AK server. I see the exp mechanics in this situation the same way, but ultimately I'll always be fine with whatever the developers think fits the project best.

    I don't really see this as "people were leveling new characters too fast for my taste", but more as "this method wasn't around very long on live, was it too exploitable that it required change?" Although I do think quite a few people fall into that first category, I'm definitely not one of them.
     
  17. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    The 1 and 1/2 times level rule has been around long after PoP and for all I know maybe it's still in place on the Live servers. I was simply asking Furst's view on the matter with 2 simple questions before I made a decision to debate him further, then Khorpus jumped down my throat. The impression I get is that some think a level 40 is dead weight in a group with a level 60 and should get no experience. I strongly disagree in many cases and I'm confident I can argue my position favorably.

    The issues with perma-paci and the SK bug I refuse to touch with a 10 foot pole, they've already been settled as far as I know anyway.
     
  18. furst

    furst Member

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    I said it was very exploitable, I didnt call power leveling a exploit but using green exp on the low level toons where they get 100% exp while being in a full group I would say is an exploit. Going 1-50 in 3-5 hours
     
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  19. Elroz

    Elroz I Feel Loved Staff Member

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    I must have misread some things said then. You're right, the 1 1/2 level mechanic has always been in play. I thought we were talking about how much exp the low level got while grouped, in which case on AK, from what I understand was 100% of the exp from the mob, but on live servers it was divided by how many people were in the group. So for instance on AK a group of level 60s grouped with a level 40 kills a level 40 mob, the level 40 would get the full amount (probably 6-7% per kill) from that. But on live servers it would be divided up as if everyone were getting exp (even though only the 40 was) and the level 40 would get about 1% per kill. I never played on AK but this is how i interpreted what has been posted before.

    After reading Furst's... first post I think he was thinking the same thing

     
  20. Zeklen

    Zeklen Member

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    Thank you for your honest answer Furst, I think I get where you're coming from. But I don't know where you're getting the idea that someone can level from 1 to 50 in 3 hours, did this happen here? I've never heard of such a thing. That's news to me.
     
  21. Oiwon

    Oiwon People Like Me

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    That's right Elroz, i had forgotten that there were at one point different shades of green. I guess i just had this little fantasy that one day i was gonna kill a green con and to my surprise get experience. ;)
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
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  22. surron

    surron People Like Me

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    DS PL until 30 (the PL'ee must have a pbaoe or use blued-two handed hammer (which didn't exists on AK))
    use a lvl 45 mage to green exp the level 30 to 40 (works faster if you use extra toons to sit out of range)
    use a lvl 60 mage to green exp the level 40 to 52ish (also faster if you have extra toons to sit out of range)


    this is 100% how AK worked. atm both mechanics are working here, as it should imo.

    if you PL a melee like this you will regret it anyways so imo its not game breaking.




    as for Khorpus... DSing the lower level toon is probably the worst way to PL someone. There are a ton more techniques that are not "green exp" which were used on regular servers.
     
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  23. sourdiesel

    sourdiesel Active Member

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    Light-blue mobs used to be Green mobs back in the day. At one point this got changed.

    On AK you could get "green exp" if the toons were in the same level range. I.E. Green con to lvl 60 but a lvl 40 toon would get exp in the same group.

    Edit: Going 1-50 in 3 hours is nearly impossible even 5 hours is a stretch and I won't believe it until I see it. I can currently PL 1-52 on p2002 in about 2 days (I'd say around 8-10 hours but never kept track) and have yet to see anyone who can do it faster.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
  24. surron

    surron People Like Me

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    I remember the good ol days SD...

    my lvl 60 warrior shakerpaging the 180 mob spawn point in grimling forest (thanks darchon for telling me about that spot), would level a level 40 toon 3 levels in 1 click of a button lol. (possible because of green exp and bugged spawn point)

    that exp would drown out around 46ish then I'd shakerpage a 8 guru fungus cycle in Fungus Grove (thanks torven after watching your videos I learned how to do that) which would take them 46-55 in like 6 hours. (100% possible on live during shakerpage era)
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
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  25. furst

    furst Member

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    when the green exp was turned on people were sitting in groups of 5 mages in Sol A destroying gnomes that were green to 50s. They leveled EXTREMELY fast to 50 in a few hours
     
  26. sourdiesel

    sourdiesel Active Member

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    I am talking about with CURRENT game mechanics fyi and not using OOR exp only 3 boxing.

    I get your point though.

    Edit: I could see how having a 2nd person and using OOR exp mechanics could cut that time in about 1/2 max.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2015
  27. Bum

    Bum I Feel Loved

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    That is my leveling plan. I afk xp the best.