shaman box questions

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by meanderthal, Sep 16, 2021.

  1. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    Hello, new player with (of course) a question or two about 3box lineups. I'm planning on trying out a MNK-SHM-WIZ trio, hoping I can focus mostly on the shaman. For reasons of looks and my imaginary world, I'd like the shaman to be either Ogre or Troll. So the question is, which one?

    If the shaman is tending to not get hit, I think I like troll-- the snare clicky and the health regen both seem like they could be useful. But if the shaman often winds up being the tank, ogre stun immunity feels important. Can the monk hold aggro off the shaman at all? Will root often break early with monk melee, shaman dots, wizard nukes all hitting?

    2nd part of the question, is monk a good choice to go with shaman/wizard? I was considering rogue or warrior, but the monk can pull, doesn't need to be behind a mob to special attack, and I thought would be better as either dps or tank than an undergeared warrior (don't want to run a knight, imaginary world reasons).
     
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  2. Tuluvien

    Tuluvien People Like Me

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    I've always run Ranger and shaman, they compliment very well. I expect monk and shaman would act similarly, except for the aggro generation, as you mention. I'd imagine that you will spend a fair bit of time ping ponging aggro back and forth between monk and shaman, which might work out well given the shaman's limited healing capability at low levels. Spread the damage out.

    Wizard will likely pull the mob from the monk, but not so much from the shaman. While shaman can take a few hits, their utility is in spellcasting and canni for mana, so you wouldn't want to be interrupted all day.

    I'm rambling now, but until monk gets some solid hate proc weapons, you likely will have bouncy aggro in this trio.
     
  3. Fadetree

    Fadetree People Like Me

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    yup, ranger+shaman is a good combo. We make great pets.
     
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  4. Mokli

    Mokli People Like Me

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  5. Break

    Break Well-Known Member

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    I played a Troll shaman on AK, and I grouped quite often with a monk. It was a good team.

    I chose the troll for the snare necklace, but it was pretty useless at higher levels. I think would have chosen an iksar for the regen+ac bonus or the ogre for the stun immunity if I had a choice to redo the race. He did look pretty cool with his Aten shield and custom Velious helm though.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
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  6. Dairmuid

    Dairmuid Member

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    I imagine i am the only other Monk-Shaman-Wizard combo on the server, i can attest its a do-able trio. The monk holds agro very well, even early on. I recommend getting a Wu's quivering staff after Level 19 or some other 2hander (Peacebringer) as the 2handers tend to hold agro better at lower levels. Given that, i would go Troll or Iksar.
     
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  7. Verdent

    Verdent People Like Me

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    OGRE all day every day. If I could make all my casters ogre with maybe the exception of my necro I would do it. I'm not joking, frontal stun immunity is godly. Put yourself in a corner, get your channeling AA's and you will be surprised what you can land.

    With the canni 5 AA and torpor your regn is so much less important than in Velious era.

    Not getting slow interrupted when mobs hit in the thousands is pretty cool.

    Anyone else so far who disagrees is wrong, Ogre is king and it's not even close.
     
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  8. thucydides

    thucydides I Feel Loved

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    A couple of questions that are helpful for these trio lineup discussions -
    Do you intend to win raid gear on any of these characters?
    What sort of content are you looking to tackle?

    Fanglore runs a sham / rogue / wizard trio and I think he likes it. I imagine this works a lot better if you have a raid-geared shaman that can tank most things.
    If you're planning on staying pretty casual, it might be easier to build a trio around kiting or pets and not need to gear any of your chars to take lots of hits.

    For example, a bard as a 3rd would give you pacify to pull, mez and charm to crowd control, additional MR debuffs to land your slows, selos to make kiting / quadding infinitely easier, etc etc etc. One thing it won't do, though, is offer a ton of dps. Coming from another angle, a necromancer could give you a pet that can tank some stuff, FD-based pulling ability not unlike the monk (though certainly less convenient than an instant-effect skill), lots of dps, and in certain undead heavy zones / dungeons, a bunch more crowd control tools. If you think you might do a bunch of root rotting, a druid can double up on your shaman's healing and dotting capabilities, which might end up feeling lackluster in groups where the shaman is the only priest.

    At lower levels, proximity aggro is quite strong, and can help a monk keep aggro. At higher levels you'll probably have to learn as you go how long to wait before slowing, or accept that your shaman is gonna take a round or two post slow.
    As yet another morsel of food for thought, you might enjoy a beastlord. They're sort of a monk/sham mashup that could free up space for a more dedicated healer (clr or dru) in that trio.
     
  9. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    thanks everyone for taking the time to reply. A little more info, since I didn't want to make the OP too long--

    the trio I'm talking about here is actually trio number 2, the first one is BST-DRU-BRD (still fussing about that last spot). Probably planning on a 3rd also, SHD-CLE-NEC (all Cazic Thule worshippers, I already think of them as the Cazic Fools, maybe ENC instead of NEC). The goal for now is simply to look around the world EQ created, having multiple groups gives me the chance to take different paths without outleveling stuff. I might in future wind up raiding, but I don't know yet if I will or on what class(es).

    For the 3rd box with SHM-WIZ, I didn't consider Ranger or Paladin for my own private "lore" type reasons (both seem like they'd fit well in terms of game mechanics). Quellious monk and Rallos Zek shaman probably makes for interesting converations during med breaks, and I've got an ogre keeping company with 2/3 of the HEHE meat recipe, but I just can't see a ranger or paladin getting along with the shaman.
     
  10. Mukk

    Mukk Active Member

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    I played a solo Troll Shaman on AK until boxing became commonplace there. The snare clicky necklace isn't as handy as you want it to be. It wears off fast, has an annoyingly long cast time and if I remember correctly doesn't stop mobs from fleeing, just makes them flee very slowly. I ended up not using it hardly at all cause mobs died just fine without it. If you have a wizard who will eventually have snare, this will be a non-issue for you. You can also just switch to wizard and hit the nuke hotkey when mob is low health. /shrug Do the quest for fun anyway, if you want though.
    As for the regen, my opinion is that it isn't as helpful as frontal stun immunity. I made my shaman here on takp a troll for sentimental reasons, but I would reroll an ogre otherwise. (I'm also in the "all my casters would be ogres if possible" camp)
    I geared my shaman with ac/hp gear, haste item and a proccing weapon. Slow, dot and melee mobs till death. Adding monk dps and wizard dps to that, you'll be killing stuff fast.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2021
  11. thucydides

    thucydides I Feel Loved

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    I think a necromancer could fit well with your sham/wiz lore-wise as well as mechanics-wise. One downside though is that nec and shm are both classes that want your attention and flourish with high apm.
     
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  12. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    Sounds like ogre shaman. Really helpful info everyone, thanks again!

    About necro, I sort of want this box focused on shaman and a different box focused on necro-- never played one, and I think it'd be good to give it attention like you said (same with enchanter and bard, altho the bard I'm planning with BST-DRU likely won't get much focus while I learn the game). Endgame, or if I'm looking to push limits of what I can 3box at a given level, I imagine I'd be re-shuffling lineups. By then I'll probably be comfortable with higher APM and more divided attention, right now I'm really fighting the interface.
     
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  13. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    MNK- Crocus
    SHM- Ganbujo
    WIZ- Pyraxis

    see you folks in Norrath and lands beyond
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2021
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  14. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    so I'm re-rolling the monk to Iksar and have another question, this time about starting stats. All STR, all STA, split 10/10?

    I originally thought all STR. Reasoning was, more threat for tanking and more damage if the shaman pulls aggro. Seems like I could feign death if about to get splatted, sham should be 2nd on the aggro list, then bind wound and start dps'ing-- so maybe, under the circumstances of this group, max health is less important than damage mitigation? All STA I'm mostly thinking about Mend being a % of max health, really. There's all the p99 guide stuff saying go 20 stam, but that's talking about an earlier era and seems largely based on either pulling for a 6man or soloing. The one forum thread a "Luclin monk starting stats" search gave me had someone plausibly arguing AGI.
     
  15. Pithy

    Pithy I Feel Loved

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    STR doesn't affect hate generation. Melee swings generate the same hate whether you miss, min hit, or max hit. DEX can affect hate generation, but only if you have a weapon with a hate proc like an SoD. DEX increases proc rate, but I doubt +20 DEX at char creation would have a big enough impact for anyone to notice without parsing logs. AGI affects how often mobs miss you, but its effect is also pretty small and caps at some modest number. (100ish AGI? I forget.)

    So STR for a little more damage, DEX for a few more procs, or STA for a bit more HP. Of those, the hardest to cap with gear is probably STA.
     
  16. meanderthal

    meanderthal Member

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    ...oh, I didn't even think to question that or read about it. Glad I asked! STA all day then, thanks for the info.
     
  17. Oiwon

    Oiwon People Like Me

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    Late to the party but wanted to chime in..

    This is my trio as well and I would recommend Troll Ogur or Iksar and definitely NOT Vah Shir/Barb (unless you just like the way they look or think they are cool for your own reasons). Everyone has a different play style. If the stun thing is important to you go for it, if Regen is important to you en route to 60 go for it. The Regen will be more valuable leveling up and the stun thing probably won't matter that much until later. Wizards can snare BTW so don't let that be your determining factor. If I had the time and desire I would reroll as a Ogur but if you would have asked me pre luclin/velious/kunark I would have said Troll/Ikky all the way. Shamans can tank adds while ur monk and wiz burn other things down. Wiz is a lazy and boring box. Easy dps does help tho.. which is why I like it. I'd strongly recommend changing to a class that can pacify. Something more interesting. This will allow you to do more stuff on your own inside dungeons and control how many mobs you pull every single time. And allow you to pull mobs you wouldn't otherwise be able to very easily. Also you don't necessarily need agro weapons as a monk, a round or two will usually generate enough agro for your trio. If anything just learn to time your slows better and learn when to nuke on ur wiz and when not to... Except don't play a wiz because they are boring AF. :)

    Also can change monk to Paladin for a pretty wicked 3 box.

    Hope this helps you or someone else in some way. Happy Grinding
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021 at 7:48 PM
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