Thats how I remember it. So I will revert my test box to pre-patch tonight and test what is up. So far I have spent about 3 hrs investigating this. I have yet to find the cause. So I am down to going pre-patch. And doing incremental patches to see what caused it.
This one has provoked a little bit of discussion recently, because it contradicts a common assumption, which was that NPCs like Naggy and the Frenzied Ghoul attacked faster with haste items on their tables and that charm pets would benefit from Jumpy robes and the summoned: muzzle of Mardu. Out of curiosity, is this an EQLive-motivated change, or did someone submit a AK log of an FBSS/CoF/RBB-dropping mob swinging at the normal rate?
Charmed pet would not fall under the "non-pet NPCs" I would assume? I was also under the impression that NPCs wielding haste items would attack faster. An easy test would be all the NToV dragons with 41% haste items. Do the NToV mobs like Aary, Ikatair, Eashen, Dagarn etc, attack 40% faster when they are carrying their haste items?
Currently, as I'm given to understand it, "non-pet NPCs" means all NPCs except summoned pets. (If it's AKurate that item haste didn't work on NPCs, then it's almost certainly also AKurate that charming the NPC in question didn't cause haste to kick in, either. Think, for example, of the NPC rule against accepting duplicate items, from which summoned but not charmed pets were exempt.)
Demonstar was the one who told me. He does a lot of decompiles, so I assume that's where he got it from. However I neglected to ask him at the time if it applied to charmed pets. I asked him yesterday and he says he doesn't know, so I'll have to research this further. Currently charmed pets do not get item haste on TAKP, but that may change. Not all NPCs wear their drops however; and raid bosses have fast attack rates, which makes them more difficult to parse. Parsing combat gameplay logs instead of carefully prepared logs are also less reliable.
for what it's worth, I'm pretty sure charmed pets equipped haste items. I agree that past a certain point though, raid bosses didn't seem to be affected by haste items, I think they just flat out didn't equip their drops (outside of weapons) past a certain era. XTC in ssra would have probably been a monster if he equipped his range haste item.
I'd always assumed so, too, but can't say I ever parsed one. Darchon dug up some AK logs of Talendor, and he doesn't seem to be swinging any faster with the CoF than without it.
It makes perfect sense to not have NPCs wear item haste because it would throw a big wrench into raid boss balance, so it doesn't surprise me.
Just parsed a charmed NPC with a muzzle on. (Shadowhaven guard) While charmed, the bash rate changed. However the melee attack delay increased (to 2 seconds, up from 1.8) instead of decreased. There might be a minimum base attack delay on charmed pets, at least on Live.
This sounds like the kind of thing SOE might have come up with as part of their post-PoP crusade to bring charm into balance. I have no idea whether or not haste items actually did anything for charm pets on Al'Kabor, but I feel reasonably confident that spell haste did - which it would not have if 2.0 were the minimum base attack delay, correct?
I just tested the mask on a decaying skeleton. Delay reduced to 2.7 as expected. Yes, certainly spell haste worked on AK. It could be capped before spell haste and after item haste. I'll keep researching.
Charmed decaying skeleton with a dagger was not using the dagger's delay. A Shik`nar Warrior was doing the same 1.4s delay while charmed and uncharmed, but also very strangely was quad attacking while charmed and doubling while uncharmed. (it did not have a weapon) Weird stuff going on.
Hi Torven, One of the fundamental reasons why I stopped playing live Everquest was that SOE crusade to retooled charming. My characters always have been build around charming mobs with a enchanter, this is the core reason why I play Everquest. From the time I was a game developer with Deep Silver Volition (the company had early beta Everquest account access Cazic Thule) until the sunset of EQ Mac, haste items absolutely effected charmed pets. I would specially farm jumpy robes for this task on EQ Mac. One of the reason why I brag about our server here is the attention to re-create the EQ Mac experience! You can find quite a lot of posts over the years speaking about haste items and charmed pets. Best Regards, Seduce
Also is this relevant? http://www.tski.co.jp/baldio/patch/20020904.html The limit on the amount of haste that can be applied to a pet has been changed (aka. The Pet Haste Cap). The amount of haste that can be placed on a pet now scales with the level of its owner. The scaling occurs in a way that is consistent with how much haste a given caster can place on his own pet (using a Level 56 Magician as an example: The idea is that both Burnout IV and Muzzle of Mardu should be useful).
2004? Thats the gates of discord era of Everquest, were are on a POP time locked expansion. Please refer to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EverQuest_expansions
I would guess this was anti-twinking code to prevent level 4 pets from having 100% haste. Since pets can receive max-level buffs, a noob pet with aego+glades+70% haste is insane.
Yes, as I mentioned this morning, I've already verified this on Live servers. The Shadowhaven guard ending up with 2 delay is an oddity that I'm going to ignore for now. (and probably won't ever get back to since there is too much to do) That doesn't tell me anything This was implemented last month.
Yes, I guess my point was that this is one of many dozens of changes made on Live after AK/PoP era that doesn't have any details but seemingly touches major mechanics.
Well get Sony to fire up the AK server back up and I'll test there instead. I had plenty of level 65s to use. Generally however if some mechanic works a certain way on Live, then it's very likely to have worked that way on AK. i.e. if it makes the game harder instead of easier. If it does the reverse or I suspect that AK might have been different for any reason, then I'll dig through logs for many hours to try and verify before I implement it. In this case Live matches everybody's recollections so I don't need to spend time investigating further.
I charmed on AK from 2010 til sunset. Sorry to be that guy, Enchanters, but regular player-used items with haste did NOT affect charmed pet attack delay. Only magician summoned masks affected charmed pet/summoned pet attack delay.
Finally got around to it, but I tested a Shadow Haven guard with a Tola robe. Attack delay was reduced while charmed. However there was some more strangeness with the Shadowhaven guards: the bash delay was reduced by the expected amount, but the weapon delay was only reduced by a fraction of the expected amount. I tested a SSeru NPC and it was reduced by the full expected amount; so for some reason SH guards are acting funny. I also tried giving a robe to a human NPC in HoH (while charmed) and it just handed it back to me.
That's interesting. I don't think I ever had a charmed NPC had anything back to me on AK. Plenty of PoP NPCs would not equip weapons, but they'd still accept mage toys and drop them when killed.
